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	<title>Comments on: The Sweet Spot of Code Commenting in Open Source</title>
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	<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/</link>
	<description>Dirk Riehle&#039;s blog about everything computer science, applied and more</description>
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		<title>By: Dirk Riehle</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-265</link>
		<dc:creator>Dirk Riehle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 20:45:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-265</guid>
		<description>Hi Mike, glad you liked the work, much more to come!

I think simple open-source tools for this are coming, but they are a far cry from what you would want professionally.

May I ask: Are you worried about mixing open with closed source for reasons of protecting your intellectual property?

A commercial solution to that problem is being offered by &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.blackducksoftware.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Black Duck Software&lt;/a&gt; but of course you have to pay. Their tools can recognize open source code in your closed projects. Is that your need? (I&#039;m honestly curious about that market.) Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mike, glad you liked the work, much more to come!</p>
<p>I think simple open-source tools for this are coming, but they are a far cry from what you would want professionally.</p>
<p>May I ask: Are you worried about mixing open with closed source for reasons of protecting your intellectual property?</p>
<p>A commercial solution to that problem is being offered by <a href="http://www.blackducksoftware.com" rel="nofollow">Black Duck Software</a> but of course you have to pay. Their tools can recognize open source code in your closed projects. Is that your need? (I&#8217;m honestly curious about that market.) Thanks!</p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-264</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 20:19:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-264</guid>
		<description>I was looking for tools to help non-engineers or code project managers spot open source code usage in proprietary code projects. This page has really been helpful for ideas (analyzing comment grammer and comment density, or comment locations might be one high-level triage method). If anyone has any other ideas for simple parsing tools that might be able to identify proprietary code versus open source source code within a given code project  I&#039;d be very grateful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was looking for tools to help non-engineers or code project managers spot open source code usage in proprietary code projects. This page has really been helpful for ideas (analyzing comment grammer and comment density, or comment locations might be one high-level triage method). If anyone has any other ideas for simple parsing tools that might be able to identify proprietary code versus open source source code within a given code project  I&#8217;d be very grateful.</p>
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		<title>By: Dirk Riehle</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-263</link>
		<dc:creator>Dirk Riehle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Apr 2009 20:34:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-263</guid>
		<description>Hey Philippe, thanks for commenting!

Yep, no value judgement or even attempted explanation of different comment densities. Without further work, this would only get us into hot water...

Naturally, we all want quality comments, not boilerplate aut0-generated ones. At present, &quot;our&quot; parser (which is ohcount, to be precise), does not do a semantic analysis as to the content of comments. It would be another good step to add that information.

Personally, I don&#039;t think that after more filtering we&#039;ll only end up with junk. Why? We have some indications, for example, commits of SLoC 1 typically come with 2 comment lines. These should be comment lines with real contents. And from other work &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.riehle.org/2008/09/23/the-dominance-of-small-code-contributions/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;we know that more than 10% of all commits are 1 SLoC commits&lt;/a&gt;... so there is good commenting going on in open source.

What I&#039;m really interested in, to be determined in future work, is of course how much commenting is needed to keep a project thriving, for example, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.riehle.org/publications/2009/open-collaboration-within-corporations-using-software-forges/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;how much does it help to get new people on board&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Philippe, thanks for commenting!</p>
<p>Yep, no value judgement or even attempted explanation of different comment densities. Without further work, this would only get us into hot water&#8230;</p>
<p>Naturally, we all want quality comments, not boilerplate aut0-generated ones. At present, &#8220;our&#8221; parser (which is ohcount, to be precise), does not do a semantic analysis as to the content of comments. It would be another good step to add that information.</p>
<p>Personally, I don&#8217;t think that after more filtering we&#8217;ll only end up with junk. Why? We have some indications, for example, commits of SLoC 1 typically come with 2 comment lines. These should be comment lines with real contents. And from other work <a href="http://www.riehle.org/2008/09/23/the-dominance-of-small-code-contributions/" rel="nofollow">we know that more than 10% of all commits are 1 SLoC commits</a>&#8230; so there is good commenting going on in open source.</p>
<p>What I&#8217;m really interested in, to be determined in future work, is of course how much commenting is needed to keep a project thriving, for example, <a href="http://www.riehle.org/publications/2009/open-collaboration-within-corporations-using-software-forges/" rel="nofollow">how much does it help to get new people on board</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Philippe Ombredanne</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-262</link>
		<dc:creator>Philippe Ombredanne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Apr 2009 03:48:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-262</guid>
		<description>Dirk:
Very nice!
I am glad you make no claim about the value of commenting, and getting some indication of it could be an interesting future contribution.

I am always appalled when I read code -- and I read a lot of it -- about the amount of useless, crappy and often auto-generated comments that sneak in the code.  IDEs are often to blame for that, together with poor developer education on the value of comments.
I much prefer well written and readable code with no comments, than a page a comment-junk laced code.

I wonder about how much of these comments really mean something, ie add something of value to the code comprehension.
One thing to consider in future studies could be trying to discern between potentially valuable  and useless comments, such as copyrights/licenses notices, changelogs and comment-junk. For the junk part, the length of structured comments (ie javadoc, perdoc, pydoc, phpdoc, etc) may be useful: it is often very short and prefixed by doc tags .
My hunch: once you have discounted the boilerplate and junk, there is not much left.
Is that a problem? Most likely not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dirk:<br />
Very nice!<br />
I am glad you make no claim about the value of commenting, and getting some indication of it could be an interesting future contribution.</p>
<p>I am always appalled when I read code &#8212; and I read a lot of it &#8212; about the amount of useless, crappy and often auto-generated comments that sneak in the code.  IDEs are often to blame for that, together with poor developer education on the value of comments.<br />
I much prefer well written and readable code with no comments, than a page a comment-junk laced code.</p>
<p>I wonder about how much of these comments really mean something, ie add something of value to the code comprehension.<br />
One thing to consider in future studies could be trying to discern between potentially valuable  and useless comments, such as copyrights/licenses notices, changelogs and comment-junk. For the junk part, the length of structured comments (ie javadoc, perdoc, pydoc, phpdoc, etc) may be useful: it is often very short and prefixed by doc tags .<br />
My hunch: once you have discounted the boilerplate and junk, there is not much left.<br />
Is that a problem? Most likely not.</p>
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		<title>By: The Shape of Code &#187; Using third party measurement data</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-261</link>
		<dc:creator>The Shape of Code &#187; Using third party measurement data</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Feb 2009 02:39:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-261</guid>
		<description>[...] about comment usage in a large number of projects (around 10,000). The authors complained in their blog about some of the referees comments and having to submit a shorter paper. I can see where the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] about comment usage in a large number of projects (around 10,000). The authors complained in their blog about some of the referees comments and having to submit a shorter paper. I can see where the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Schwinl! &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Dix-neuf pourcents de commentaires&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-260</link>
		<dc:creator>Schwinl! &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Dix-neuf pourcents de commentaires&#8230;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Feb 2009 00:09:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-260</guid>
		<description>[...] open-source, on trouve en moyenne près d’une ligne sur cinq de commentaires, selon un papier de Dirk Riehle (voir également sur son [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] open-source, on trouve en moyenne près d’une ligne sur cinq de commentaires, selon un papier de Dirk Riehle (voir également sur son [...]</p>
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		<title>By: 19 pour cent de commentaires &#124; Sur la route d'Oxiane</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-259</link>
		<dc:creator>19 pour cent de commentaires &#124; Sur la route d'Oxiane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 17:53:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-259</guid>
		<description>[...] on trouve en moyenne près d&#8217;une ligne sur cinq de commentaires, selon un papier de Dirk Riehle (voir également sur son [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] on trouve en moyenne près d&#8217;une ligne sur cinq de commentaires, selon un papier de Dirk Riehle (voir également sur son [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Dirk Riehle</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-258</link>
		<dc:creator>Dirk Riehle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 17:42:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-258</guid>
		<description>@AA Thanks for reminding us; yes, we might do that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@AA Thanks for reminding us; yes, we might do that.</p>
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		<title>By: AA</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-257</link>
		<dc:creator>AA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 17:32:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-257</guid>
		<description>Did you consider sending your work to MSR? I guess they&#039;d value your paper more. Deadline has been extended to begin of March.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did you consider sending your work to MSR? I guess they&#8217;d value your paper more. Deadline has been extended to begin of March.</p>
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		<title>By: Labnotes &#187; Rounded Corners 224 – Broken gets fixed, shoddy lasts forever</title>
		<link>http://dirkriehle.com/2009/02/04/the-sweet-spot-of-code-commenting-in-open-source/#comment-256</link>
		<dc:creator>Labnotes &#187; Rounded Corners 224 – Broken gets fixed, shoddy lasts forever</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 04:01:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.riehle.org/?p=585#comment-256</guid>
		<description>[...] On the other hand, open source is a corpus of work you can easily analyze, and it turns out that 20% is the sweet spot of commenting in open source projects. So there, another good rule of [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] On the other hand, open source is a corpus of work you can easily analyze, and it turns out that 20% is the sweet spot of commenting in open source projects. So there, another good rule of [...]</p>
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